Northwest Lichenologists

Roger the Amateur

  • 01 Mar 2017 8:16 AM
    Reply # 4641409 on 4640367
    Roger George wrote:

    I have added 3 new species to my photo gallery; all were growing on the same fallen Quercus garryana twig. I have identified them as, Parmelia sulcata, Ramalina farinacea, and Usnea subfloridana. Please sound off if I have aired or if you need more info.

     

    The immediate area of ~ 40 acres is a Garry Oak/Snowberry and  Doug Fir association, with understory trees Oval-leaved Viburnum, Saskatoon Serviceberry, Vine Maple, Pacific Ninebark, Black Hawthorn, and Indian Plum among others. Based on dendrochronology from a recently-fallen Quercus garryana slab, the grove is ~225 yrs. old. The grove is cut through by a creek, it's surrounded by wet prairie remnant on 3 sides, and bounded on 1 side by a road.


    Hi Roger,

    I'd be pretty careful with your Usnea species. U subfloridana is around but not particularly common. First, check and see if the medulla is UV+. Cut several places on main branches, parallel to the length, right in to the axis, so you have half of the inside showing. Put that under short wave UV and see if it jumps out as strong blueish white. If not, you most likely don't have U subfloridana. If that is the case, look carefully at the structure (cigar-shaped connections of branches, isidia and/or soredia, soralia shape, CMA - see McCune's book)) and see where you can get in the key. good luck - Usnea is a difficult genus!
    Best, Daphne


  • 01 Mar 2017 3:38 PM
    Reply # 4642111 on 4641409
    Deleted user
    daphne stone wrote:
    Hi Roger,

    I'd be pretty careful with your Usnea species. U subfloridana is around but not particularly common. First, check and see if the medulla is UV+. Cut several places on main branches, parallel to the length, right in to the axis, so you have half of the inside showing. Put that under short wave UV and see if it jumps out as strong blueish white. If not, you most likely don't have U subfloridana. If that is the case, look carefully at the structure (cigar-shaped connections of branches, isidia and/or soredia, soralia shape, CMA - see McCune's book)) and see where you can get in the key. good luck - Usnea is a difficult genus!
    Best, Daphne


    Hi Daphne,

    I don't have a UV light yet, but it's on my wish list.

    Besides McCune & Geiser, I am using Consortium of North American Lichen Herbaria online, as well as Sharnoff's photo site to keep things on the careful side.

    I'm working through MPNW key again. My example has a few branches with constricted bases, but by-and-large the branches are uniform. The CMA images have only 2 longitudinal sections that resemble my example; U. wasmuthii & U. subfloridana.

    In a couple weeks I should have materials for P test as well as a USB microscope, so I will keep working this Usnea.

    On the U. subfloridana 'not particularly common' note, I notice that Bruce says in the key that U. wasmuthii is rare in Washington too. I will not be surprised to find unusual lichens at the preserve as we have over half-a-dozen vascular plants that are endangered, threatened, rare, or unusual. While folks have been working the vascular plants here for over 20 years and new finds continue, no one has listed the fungi or lichens yet so I'm keen to jump on it.

    Thanks for the help Daphne -I need all I can get- and by all means please pass on any further insights.  :)

  • 01 Mar 2017 7:21 PM
    Reply # 4642243 on 4606160

    Roger, waysofenlichenment.com is a good source of pictures also.


  • 02 Mar 2017 2:12 PM
    Reply # 4644344 on 4642243
    Deleted user
    Steve Sheehy wrote:

    Roger, waysofenlichenment.com is a good source of pictures also.

     


    Roger that Steve; thanks! Another nice source I found last week is Encyclopedia of Life. There doesn't appear to be a lichen section per se, but entering a species in the search brings up photos and details of morphology, distribution maps, and references.

     

    Here's the page at EOL for Hypogymnia physodes, which I just added to my list and the gallery. http://eol.org/pages/196270/details  

  • 02 Mar 2017 3:51 PM
    Reply # 4644466 on 4642111
    Roger George wrote:
    daphne stone wrote:
    Hi Roger,

    I'd be pretty careful with your Usnea species. U subfloridana is around but not particularly common. First, check and see if the medulla is UV+. Cut several places on main branches, parallel to the length, right in to the axis, so you have half of the inside showing. Put that under short wave UV and see if it jumps out as strong blueish white. If not, you most likely don't have U subfloridana. If that is the case, look carefully at the structure (cigar-shaped connections of branches, isidia and/or soredia, soralia shape, CMA - see McCune's book)) and see where you can get in the key. good luck - Usnea is a difficult genus!
    Best, Daphne


    Hi Daphne,

    I don't have a UV light yet, but it's on my wish list.

    Besides McCune & Geiser, I am using Consortium of North American Lichen Herbaria online, as well as Sharnoff's photo site to keep things on the careful side.

    I'm working through MPNW key again. My example has a few branches with constricted bases, but by-and-large the branches are uniform. The CMA images have only 2 longitudinal sections that resemble my example; U. wasmuthii & U. subfloridana.

    In a couple weeks I should have materials for P test as well as a USB microscope, so I will keep working this Usnea.

    On the U. subfloridana 'not particularly common' note, I notice that Bruce says in the key that U. wasmuthii is rare in Washington too. I will not be surprised to find unusual lichens at the preserve as we have over half-a-dozen vascular plants that are endangered, threatened, rare, or unusual. While folks have been working the vascular plants here for over 20 years and new finds continue, no one has listed the fungi or lichens yet so I'm keen to jump on it.

    Thanks for the help Daphne -I need all I can get- and by all means please pass on any further insights.  :)


    Probably chem tests on Usneas won't help much. The CMA is helpful, and the UV will tell you if you have one of the 2 most common UV+ spp. Look again at your cigar-shaped - be sure it isn't one of those.  And I didn't think about where you are located - possibly subfloriana is more common up there.


    Also, id you are interested in difficult spp, I'm teaching a Cladonia workshop down at Siskiyou Field Institute 11-12 April, and it could help you a lot. And I could look at your Usnea!


    Best, Daphne




  • 06 Mar 2017 3:43 PM
    Reply # 4651728 on 4606160
    Deleted user

    Daphne, I'm not particularly looking for hard, rather I'm just looking at what I find in one particular area. Thanks for the invite! I expect I will be pretty busy then so I'll have to pass. Should you , et al, get a wild hair to visit the preserve, I can arrange that. ;)

     

    So I did get the plugable microscope and in looking at the Usnea more I'm just not seeing the 'cigar' shape in the branches. I captured a new image of the holdfast & lower branches with the scope and put it in the Gallery:  http://northwest-lichenologists.wildapricot.org/resources/SiteAlbums/1816539/Usnea%20subfloridana17b.jpg

     

    The crack at the base of the left-most stem is a nice exposure for the CMA and I'll be reviewing images in Microlichens. In this new image the medulla and axis appear about the same thickness and I think in my original longitudinal section that I didn't cut through the medulla far enough to expose the axis.

     

    I hope it isn't a major faux pas to mention fungi, but I'm gonna risk it. :-O In February I found a bracket fungus which I identified as Daedalea quercina, or Oak Mazegill. I checked with the university and they think I may be right, however they say I need to revisit the site to get some host-wood specimens for ID and to track the growth. Apparently this species is rare west of the Mississippi and only known from California and Oregon. Photos available if welcomed. :D

    Last modified: 06 Mar 2017 3:43 PM | Deleted user
  • 07 Mar 2017 7:52 AM
    Reply # 4652872 on 4606160
    Bruce McCune (Administrator)

    This is just a guess, but the growth form in your original photo (with profuse long fibrils and otherwise sparse branching) is typical of Usnea silesiaca, a.k.a. U. madeirensis.

  • 07 Mar 2017 12:36 PM
    Reply # 4653514 on 4652872
    Deleted user
    Bruce McCune wrote:

    This is just a guess, but the growth form in your original photo (with profuse long fibrils and otherwise sparse branching) is typical of Usnea silesiaca, a.k.a. U. madeirensis.


    Mmmm...at one point I had ruled out Group 2 in the key because I saw my example as bushy and not pendulous. I then realized that I didn't actually know the orientation of the branch on the tree before it fell, so my example may be pendulous. :-O

    Now re-reading the key for U. silesiaca, it is prefaced with 'Branches with abundant annular cracks' and I don't see that feature.

    Well, off to track the  U. silesiaca lead... Thanks Bruce! :)

  • 08 Mar 2017 1:00 PM
    Reply # 4655575 on 4606160
    Deleted user

    Hi all; me again. :-O

     

    So Daphne, I read your reply on the Usnea growth rate and thought I'd bring one bit back here to discuss. You said "And a cautionary note - don't expect to be able to ID Usnea by looking a photos on line - as you can read in the Forum, photos are great but don't always show the characters you need."

     

    I keep revisiting my  Usnea sp. after reading replies here and accounts elsewhere, and I'm wondering what characters you, Bruce, et al would be looking at for a confident ID if you had the specimen in-hand?

  • 09 Mar 2017 7:30 AM
    Reply # 4656904 on 4606160

    The CMA is good. The shape of soralia and if it has isidia or not. UV+ or UV- (that is the 1st char I'd look at if there are big white annular rings). Then I'd use my previous knowledge, which as i mentioned, will be in a little pamplet in a year or so.


    They're just really tough and highly variable.


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